Aging and Decluttering Successfully: A Conversation between Rita Black and Dr. Christine Li

Dr. Christine Li [00:00:00]:
Welcome back

Dr. Christine Li [00:00:01]:
to the Make Time For Success podcast. This is Christine Li, Dr. Li, and this is episode number 196. Recently, my wonderful friend and the amazing weight loss and weight management coach, whom you've heard on this podcast before, her name is Rita Black. Rita invited me back onto her podcast, which is the Thin Thinking Podcast, to talk about the twin issues of aging and clutter. And lately, I have been focusing on both of those issues very intensively to help my clients and the clients who have been coming to me. And we just got into such an amazing conversation that I asked Rita if I could re air that recording on my own podcast. And so you're going to hear Rita being the host of the podcast in this recording, but it's really me providing the main teachings because I'm the guest on her podcast. So I hope that is clear.

Dr. Christine Li [00:01:09]:
I think you understand what I'm saying. I wanna thank Rita for being so generous in doing this interview with me because it helped me to see that when we are women in midlife, that we are not in a state of decline, like many people will make you think and society will sometimes make you think. But, actually, it's the reverse. We're in the state of expansion and growth and development. And I came to that realization in the midst of this interview. I want you to hear the entire thing, listen to all the stories that Rita and I share inside this episode and enjoy the episode. I want to also mention that this was all in the efforts of promoting my upcoming free 5 day decluttering challenge. It is called reenergize your home, and it starts September 16th in the year 2024, if you're listening to this on replay.

Dr. Christine Li [00:02:12]:
And we are starting soon, and I'm so excited. And all you need to do to get into this challenge and participate in the mass decluttering that we're about to do is to go to procrastinationcoach.com /yes to sign up. And you just give your name and your email address, and you'll get all the information that you need after that. And one last note before we hop into the episode, it was Rita's birthday 2 days ago on September 10th. She turned 60. So I wanted to send a very happy birthday message to the whole world to Rita Black because she's been wonderful, an amazing friend, teacher, mentor, and weight loss coach. Alright. So let's go listen to this conversation together now.

Dr. Christine Li [00:03:08]:
Hi. I'm Dr. Christine Li, and I'm a psychologist and a procrastination coach. I've helped thousands of people move past procrastination and overwhelm so they could begin working to their potential. In this podcast, you're going to learn powerful strategies for getting your mind, body, and energy to work together so that you can focus on what's really important and accomplish the goals you want to achieve. When you start living within your full power, you're going to see how being productive can be easy and how you can create success on demand. Welcome to the make time for success podcast.

Rita Black [00:03:51]:
Let's welcome D.r Li. Hey, Christine. Welcome back to the Thin Thinking podcast.

Dr. Christine Li [00:03:58]:
Thank you, Rita. So good to be back. So good to talk to you again.

Rita Black [00:04:02]:
You know, you are probably how many times have we had you on? I think this is your 3rd time, which is really awesome. 3rd time, lucky. Well, every time we have you on is lucky.

Dr. Christine Li [00:04:12]:
Thank you so much.

Rita Black [00:04:13]:
Christine and I were just sitting here talking about aging, of course, which is our topic for the month. And Christine and I, I think I'm a few years ahead of Christine, but we're both heading into that zone. And we have a lot

Rita Black [00:04:28]:
to talk about. But before we

Rita Black [00:04:30]:
do, I just want Christine to introduce herself to you and just let you know, because Christine does a very special thing for people and I want her to tell you.

Dr. Christine Li [00:04:38]:
Okay. Thanks, Rita. Hi. My friends on the podcast, I love Rita's community. And Rita and I have so enjoyed working together and kind of having clients in common and having so much information to share with each other about the work, about these issues that women face just for being women and also navigating such complex roles that we do. Right? No matter what your age is, being a woman is just an interesting, fascinating, multilayered situation. And I think when you get into middle age and beyond, I was just talking with Rita about how you have this positive energy of liveliness and vitality and wishes and what you wanna build for yourself, coexisting with a lot of negative energy, which can be anything, it could be illness, it could be worries, it could be job stress, it could be family stress, it could be physical clutter, lots of things that threaten to kind of set you off balance from a healthy, vibrant, positive, self directed journey forward. And what I do, I'm a psychologist in New York is basically I enjoy helping people to see what is going on with their habits, their daily and weekly and monthly habits, maybe their life habits.

Dr. Christine Li [00:06:13]:
What is going on with those habits that might be holding them back in some way that is familiar, maybe not so adaptive, maybe can be tweaked just from a word or 2 or a couple sessions so that the person can feel much more themselves, much more like they're ready to go instead of feeling like they're worried about everything. And that is really what lights me up. And this is what I do for my own life. I've been doing this for my own life for several decades. And I've developed all sorts of techniques and philosophies about what helps people to just get going after a period of feeling stuck, even if that period has been many, many years long. I call myself procrastination coach because I spent the first part of my life as a severe procrastinator, And I'm spending the 2nd part of my life trying to help people to really avoid that need to rely on avoidance and maladaptive techniques of coping, like stress, like negativity, like not doing things, like being sedentary, those kinds of things. And we've all been there, both sides, the positive and the negative. So I'm just trying to kind of help everybody to lean a little bit more positively, especially in midlife and beyond when the stresses are really potent and oftentimes not fully discussed or supported, when there's just a lot of stress around? I think

Dr. Christine Li [00:07:49]:
there's a I there's a lot, I see those two lines. I see an age of self mastery because you're at this age where you've done so much in your life. You have a lot of wisdom, and experience, but what isn't mastered really gets in your way, or what is unfulfilled really haunts you. So you have this, you know, confidence, but at the same time, it's kind of dulled by limiting beliefs, limiting habits, like you were saying, and a very loud inner critic that's like, well, you think you're hot stuff, but, you know, you haven't done that yet, you know, or you're still doing that, or you never did this. So, you know, it's a time to come to center and really look at everything. But what we were gonna talk about a little bit or at least as a diving off point is clutter. Uh-huh. Because I told Christine, I said, I wanna tell you the story, Christine.

Rita Black [00:08:47]:
And I said, I'm gonna wait till the podcast microphone is on so I can tell it. So my husband, as many of my listeners have listened for a long enough time, they all know and love my husband because he is a hoarder. Like, he'll bring in stuff. I mean, my house is pretty clear of clutter because I work very hard. Everything goes up into the attic. And so we have been working for a couple of years. I've been talking about this ongoing attic project. My son is home.

Rita Black [00:09:13]:
And so my son was like, I will work with dad on the attic for a few days. So so they went up and they were pulling down books, and my husband's very attached to books and all of his books. But they bring down these big plastic black things. And I'd I I don't I'm like, what the heck are these? And these big long cylinder things. And my husband was like and they're like covered with, I don't know, stuff like dust and cobwebs. And I'm like, are you taking that stuff down the street? And my husband's like, no. No. I mean, this is our old shelving unit that we for sure, like, don't you think one day we're gonna need it again? And I was like, take that down to the street.

Rita Black [00:09:57]:
No. I was like, no. If we need to buy another one, we will. And, you know, he gets this little boy look like, really? I've gotta let do all this. And I'm like, yeah. You you do. So why is that, Christine? Like, like, because I see that so much. I mean, even myself, I was cleaning out my office the other day, and and I was I was, you know, clearly things that are just like Rita, chuck it away.

Rita Black [00:10:23]:
But there was this even taxes. Like, my son was working on my taxes from 1994. They're up in the attic. And and I was like, oh, those are receipts. I might wanna look at them and remember what I bought in 1994. I mean, like, how ridiculous is that? But there was this part of my heart. So what is that about? And why as we get older, does it seem to get deeper? You know, that I would love to let that go.

Dr. Christine Li [00:10:52]:
I I love you so much, and I have a feeling I will love your husband just as much as

Dr. Christine Li [00:10:58]:
I love you.

Dr. Christine Li [00:11:00]:
I think I can't explain that entirely. Right? It's a little bit of a mystery of life is is what is attachment and what makes us care for things as we do care for people, care for shelving, care for old shelving that we haven't even thought about. And I think rather than explaining it, I just would like to marvel at it. Like we're all capable of that attachment process. But what your story makes me think of is how much room that we have for attachment, but also how much room we can create when we know that not all attachments are created equal, and that we have some say over that process after the attachment is made. And, of course, before the attachment, we can also say, you know what? I'm not touching that. I'm walking by that in the store. They say that once you touch a sweater in a store, you feel like it's yours.

Dr. Christine Li [00:12:04]:
I I can't explain why that is, but I know that that's what they say. Like, if you if you wanna kind of maintain a budget, don't touch things when you're shopping. And I do think that it's all energy exchange. So I teach people that our physical clutter is energized. It may seem inanimate to you, but it's literally, you know, comprised of atoms and also contains our projections of memories, of thoughts, of value, of emotion, of sentimentality, of history, of sometimes even hatred. Right? Sometimes you hate your clutter. It can carry really intense energy, I think also. And the fact that we call it clutter is just a whole other layer of energy that we have to manage, which is I am living with something that I have deemed not necessary, not beautiful, not loved.

Dr. Christine Li [00:13:13]:
And I think as I've worked with people to gradually get the courage to chip away at their clutter day by day, I see how important it is to give yourself that zone of freedom in your space. Because we're talking not just some random space. This is your home. And it's it's very much like your heart outside of your body is your home. And it should be comfortable and it should be as open, I think, as you can manage. And that doesn't mean that it has to be clutter free or minimalist in any way, but that it reflects kind of your freedom of movement and your freedom of feeling. And we are allowed to be attached to anything that we want. Right? Rita can see in the video, I've got this kind of neon funky piece of art behind me.

Dr. Christine Li [00:14:06]:
And I, for whatever reason, I know a bunch of reasons, got attached to it. And I purchased it, and it's in my home. Does it fit with anything else in my home? No. But I'm allowed to do that. And I celebrate the fact that we get to do this as individuals. That we get to decide who we fall in love with. Right? We get to decide what we care about. That's kind of the beauty of living.

Dr. Christine Li [00:14:30]:
Clutter for me is kind of almost the opposite. It's like what we've already decided we've fallen out of love with. And much like Uh-huh. You wouldn't necessarily keep a whole bunch of your ex boyfriends or girlfriends in your home with you. You know, why are we actually tolerating this energy that we no longer connect with that no longer makes us feel elevated or well? It actually makes us feel depleted or burdened. And, you know, when you really take a look at it, it's a very important thing to sort out. And I see people, including myself, leaving it to the very last item on the to do list. And then it's like this nagging thing because, you know, every time you walk by the pantry, you see it's a mess or you see the expired food.

Dr. Christine Li [00:15:22]:
And it's it's like a constant pinging. And what would life be like without this noise? Right? How would you feel? How would you operate? Could you do more things? Could you rest better? Could you feel better about yourself? All these things are possible.

Rita Black [00:15:40]:
Yeah, that's amazing. You're absolutely right. Before we turned on the microphone, you mentioned something that was interesting to me about clutter. Because you were talking about passive and active. Passive and active. Can you speak to that a little bit? I I wanna know more about, like, we collect things passively and then actively, I think is what you were kind of putting it into a phrase.

Dr. Christine Li [00:16:07]:
What comes to mind I don't quite remember what we were talking about, but what comes to mind is actually women of a certain age are getting clutter that they never asked for. Oh, k. Were we talking about that? Because we're talking about talking

Dr. Christine Li [00:16:22]:
about this. So, like, women of a certain age are getting, like, passed down stuff from their parents or

Dr. Christine Li [00:16:28]:
or, from other people are downsizing. They're getting their stuff. Their kids are leaving their stuff in their home, in their basements. Their gifts coming in because gifts will come in. And there's there's no reverse flow. There's there's no in and then out process. And what I've seen is really woman after woman after woman with a whole room or several rooms in their home that are a source of embarrassment, that cannot house people, do not serve their original purpose, feel like they're constantly calling the women to declutter. And it's not junk either.

Dr. Christine Li [00:17:16]:
It's actually serious stuff in there. Pictures of family. It's, old paperwork from old careers. And it's stuff with a lot of sentimental and life meaning. And I I really always no matter what I do, I really try to to respect and honor the person's journey because just because I don't care about the stuff doesn't mean that it's not super important in some way to their life story. Right? And it can take years to coach people sometimes into letting go of certain things. And I am just not surprised by that at all. Like I get it because you know what? There are things I can't even think of for myself right now that I need to let go of that I'm still not letting go of.

Dr. Christine Li [00:18:06]:
Right? I'm not gonna judge because I'm just like you. This is why I've proclaimed myself the leader of the declutters because I have the same issues. But the difference now is that I'm bringing an energy of no judgment and the promise of freedom afterwards. Right? And what we do when we keep our clutter is saying, you know what? My freedom is just not doing it at all. Right? I'm choosing the freedom of the short term. I don't have to touch that stuff. I don't have to get my hands dirty. I don't have to waste my time with that pile that I hate.

Dr. Christine Li [00:18:43]:
You know?

Dr. Christine Li [00:18:43]:
And and Make those decisions. I mean, because it is it is tough.

Dr. Christine Li [00:18:48]:
It is. It's emotional.

Dr. Christine Li [00:18:50]:
And sometimes overwhelm. We don't wanna feel those feelings.

Dr. Christine Li [00:18:54]:
And sometimes we're already overwhelmed even before doing that. Right? Just regular life, just holding down the job, the fort, everything is already that. And Taxing a mess. And people are really feeling short on time as well, I think for a long, long time. Right? So, you know, I think clutter is just always gonna be a potential issue. But I do think that it's one of the simpler ways that you can make a big difference in your own energy. What I've learned through this process as well is time, if you're not looking at us on video, many of you are not. One finger I'm holding up, it represents time and the other represents energy.

Dr. Christine Li [00:19:43]:
And so many of us spend so much of our effort really trying to save time in some way, or we regret the use of time or blah, blah, blah. When really, what we're actually needing to manage a little bit more closely and smartly is our energy. Because our energy is really like our life force. Time is just always gonna be ticking by. We really don't have control over that so much. Right? We can try to make the most of what we have. But our energy is something that not only can we use really much more carefully and mindfully, but it's also something that we can replenish. And that's something that I've learned through social media and following all these people who were saying this kind of a thing, but also seeing that when you get rid of clutter, you actually get your energy returned to you.

Dr. Christine Li [00:20:37]:
And that is just for me, like, oh, this is fun. Yeah. I I don't need anything. Yeah. I need, you know, this new high that doesn't cost anything. That is just like, I can get this at any time. I can help someone declutter, or I can declutter myself. And I just think it's important to really have people understand that their energy is at stake.

Rita Black [00:21:02]:
Yeah. That's amazing. What are some main roadblocks that you see with people and decluttering? Like, what are some, you know, other than like just feeling overwhelmed or too tired? Like, if I was actually gonna, like, if you were like Rita, will, you know, all those books behind you, like what? It doesn't seem like you've read them in the last year or 2. Like, why don't you just put them in a box and give them away? You know, I would say, well, I might need them one day. I might need them for research. I might need them to refer to. So why it didn't like there must be some some main psychological, like, you know, what are some of the main ones that you see coming up for people when you're working with them?

Dr. Christine Li [00:21:50]:
Okay. You've already covered, I think, one of them at least. So three things come to mind, not all psychological. The first is physical pain. Some people are ailing. Right? Their knees are not working so well. Their back aches. Clutter can be right? Garage clutter can be really heavy, kind of.

Dr. Christine Li [00:22:09]:
Right? Some scary stuff in there maybe. Or just so many years piled up. It can be almost dangerous a situation. So I've definitely heard people saying, you know, I physically can't. And I've seen time and time again that actually you can. Right? And it just you need you need the support. You need to make sure everybody's safe, but everybody can do this piece by piece decluttering. And I definitely teach this piece by piece like you do 1 to 3 items, call it good, and then learn to nurture that feeling of Oh, wow, I've accomplished something.

Dr. Christine Li [00:22:45]:
I've started, I'm not injured. I'm not hating this. I'm actually finding stuff, and I'm making decisions, and I feel okay by this. So it's this kind of, you know, healing process. I do think it can be a healing process. The second thing was what you touched on was the idea that I might need this someday. Big block for people, including me. Lots of us were raised on the don't waste anything, don't anything go kind of model.

Dr. Christine Li [00:23:12]:
I certainly was raised in that way. But as we know from just thinking about positive psychology and manifestation language, that anytime you're feeling in need, you're actually gonna put yourself in a state of need. So that there is a fear that there's something that you're gonna be unprepared for, that you won't be able to manage, that you won't have the resources for. But when you look at your abundance of clutter and your abundance of resources and talents and money to to be honest, there really is no lack. And honestly, you wanna put yourself in a state of abundance anyway, because Yeah. You really are living abundantly. You have so much that you don't even know what to do with this stuff. And really, what would it be like to not live with that kind of worry anyway? And just like your husband with the shelves, like, if he hadn't gone to that space, would he ever have thought about that at all? It just kind of like, we think about it when it's in our presence, but when it's gone, we don't have to think about it anymore.

Dr. Christine Li [00:24:20]:
So there's no need. And do people make mistakes in that regard? Sure. Right? Maybe one out of 50 times you declutter something and you really, really, really shouldn't have. But you'll survive that too. There is no such I I just think people don't fall into massive calamities because of decluttering. I think the calamity is really just leaving the clutter there to just grow. I think that's the big calamity. Okay? Got it.

Dr. Christine Li [00:24:48]:
And then the third thing

Dr. Christine Li [00:24:49]:
was really the waste issue is is Mhmm. Figuring that you're doing something wrong. And I think we really just need to flip that whole conversation around and say like, what is gonna serve me at the highest level? And you get to fill in the blank there, but oftentimes it's not keeping this item of clutter. Generally, people know in their, you know, intuitive brain, intuitive that intuitive voice inside them, that it is clutter, and that it it does need to go kind of a thing. You know? So we can just rest on that and let everything else work out as it needs to.

Rita Black [00:25:32]:
What about objects that certain things that quite like, for instance, my mother was, you know, who passed in pretty much just 20 years ago. Exactly. And she, when she passed, left pieces of jewelry and little things, and she would have written the best thing about this, those things. It wasn't the jewelry, but she wrote these little notes that said, this was this and this was this little and, you know, for me, those notes mean more than the object itself. But what do you do? And and, you know, I have a set of pans of hers that are still really good. You can can you believe this? But they're getting a little crotchety now, but they they were like, the 19 fifties. But these were like they built things to last back then. You know, like, those old cars you see running around these pants just like it had a long, long shelf life.

Rita Black [00:26:27]:
And I think of getting rid of them and I'm like, but that's my mom. And so what and her cookbooks do, like, she had these big collection of cookbooks. I haven't looked at them in years. I would never use any of those recipes. They're all, like, circa 19 sixties, seventies recipes. Right? But, like, things like that where you're like, that's represents something to me that is really valuable to me. How do I let that go? Because, like, they take up space and they I don't need them anymore. And, like, the pans are getting now cattery and stuff.

Rita Black [00:27:00]:
I don't need them at my kitchen.

Dr. Christine Li [00:27:03]:
So this is a beautiful question. It's I think the central question for so Yeah. Much true is. And also about so much of the clutter. And you said so much in there. It's fascinating. Right? And you said, it's my mother. Right? And it represents so much.

Dr. Christine Li [00:27:20]:
And that is all true. And you'll never lose your mother. Yes. So that's just for me very central that no matter what you do with the stuff, you'll never lose your mother. And then my question would be to you, like, what do you wish for and the wishes that you had, were not to get rid of your mother. There was nothing in that what you said about getting rid of your mother, but you did wish for more space and you did wish to be maybe done with the tattered pants.

Rita Black [00:27:55]:
Yes.

Dr. Christine Li [00:27:56]:
And that's something I think to be honored. And so there is that energetic connection with your mother. And she did that lovingly, right? With the notes, with the jewelry, and with the cookbooks. And there is love everywhere. But I think you can safely and honoring your mother, still let that stuff go.

Rita Black [00:28:21]:
Do you have, like, a, like, a system like, something like that seems to be something I did with the pants was I put them in a box, and I didn't get rid of them yet. I just, like, put them away and I kinda hid them away so that they weren't in my cupboards anymore. They were just in this box. And then I forgot about them. You know, like, I forgot they were there. They were like you know, I kinda said a little prayer over them as I was taking them out and had some. You know, like, thank you for serving me for my mother. And then, yeah, and I forgot about them, and I could move them to, you know, a trash bin.

Rita Black [00:28:56]:
But I had to, like, kind of know that I was gonna be over them before I put them away. You know, they weren't gonna serve anybody. I wasn't gonna get them away to Goodwill, but they were actually gonna bend. So is that part of a process? Like, it does do some people have to do that? Like, kinda have to, like, kind of have a middle zone where you're not getting rid of them yet, but you're, like, out of sight, out of mind so that you can de neutralize that attachment?

Dr. Christine Li [00:29:24]:
I would say yes, based on your story. And also, I'm sure that's true for many. I am thinking that because I help women declutter in the space with other women online, that you can kind of bypass that phase because the energy of people freeing themselves of the stuff they don't need and seeing the effects in other people's lives is really contagious.

Dr. Christine Li [00:29:54]:
So when you have to do it

Dr. Christine Li [00:29:55]:
on your own, yeah, you're gonna feel the burden of it much more powerfully. Yeah. Especially if it's this intimate stuff. But it's alleviated when you have the company of other women who are maybe dealing with stuff that is just as sentimental. So

Rita Black [00:30:12]:
And probably probably not bypassing the guilt you might feel for giving away something of your mother's or throwing something away that she treasured. You know, like that. Like, if you see somebody else doing the same, you're like, oh, okay. Yeah. I get it. I can do that too without the guilt. Because I think guilt comes in to it as well. Does it not?

Dr. Christine Li [00:30:34]:
Guilt is everywhere when it comes to clutter. Right? Guilt for having it, guilt for not having done away with it, guilt for feeling guilty about your mother's stuff. Oh, like, there's so many different ways. Guilt is tricky that way. But again, once that stuff is out of your home, you no longer have to deal with that kind of energy and think about what kind of energy do I want my home to be filled with? And does this stuff match that vibe?

Rita Black [00:31:02]:
Yeah. So I have another question. This is so fascinating. So as we age, you know, I'm gonna be 60, and I have been contemplating this so much this year, just like the whole, you know, what my next chapter of life is. But at the same time, as you get older, you're also looking at the different chapters of your life in the past. And, again, I'm not surrounded by my past. Like, I my office is very present. I mean, even though a lot of things, I was like, I

Rita Black [00:31:33]:
could probably declutter this,

Rita Black [00:31:35]:
but, but it's very, I don't have a lot of like things around me that are reminded me of me, like when I was in my twenties or my thirties. And, but if I got rid of something like I have articles of clothing, for instance, you know, it was so hilarious. I remember because, you know, I've lost weight. Like, I lost weight a long time ago and I've kept it off. And I remember one of the things is like when I had lost weight and I was like around 45 or something, I still had something from high school. Like, I couldn't believe that I had it. Like, they made clothes pretty good back then too, you know. So I had this shirt that I could fit into that shirt.

Rita Black [00:32:11]:
And I was like, I don't wanna give up this shirt. I had this in high school. And and then, you know, during one of my thin phases in high school, because I was heavy in high school as well. Oh, he was like, I'm fit into it now, and I'm not gonna give it up. It was then I was just like, really, you're being so ridiculous. But, you know, like, we have these encapsulated memories of who we were. And and we don't wanna get those up because it's almost like I mean, like, this from an an energy and from a psychological is like, I'm giving away that piece of my life. You know, it kinda feels very attached to that.

Rita Black [00:32:47]:
Right? Does that do you see that a lot too?

Dr. Christine Li [00:32:52]:
A little less. Older. Like A little less.

Dr. Christine Li [00:32:55]:
Because I see I think

Dr. Christine Li [00:32:56]:
I see more the the kind of passively received Mhmm. More so than hanging on to pieces of a former life, I would say. But what you make me think is that this phase of our lives, the post 50 years is still a developmental phase. Right? And so we're still we're still growing and changing, even though parts of society may not see it that way. Yeah. They see it more as a stagnation or a decline. And I think when you hang on to a past phase, it may block maybe a more vibrant movement into what your next phase could be. That's what that I would say of any phase.

Dr. Christine Li [00:33:49]:
Right? It's it's that thinking about my, you know, your security blankets, when you're a kid, right? You don't really do that when you're 50. You're, you know, you might have memories attached. But generally, like we're good, we're good without this stuff, that that may be the the main point of them all that you're good without the need for the stuff.

Rita Black [00:34:14]:
Mhmm. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. That's interesting. I love how you were saying your mother's 83 and she's just learning ping pong. That's so great. It's so true.

Rita Black [00:34:26]:
We are always growing and developing if we choose to.

Dr. Christine Li [00:34:30]:
I would say she's not learning. She's probably gonna we're we're aiming for LA Olympics.

Rita Black [00:34:38]:
Is she really good?

Dr. Christine Li [00:34:39]:
She's she's I've got my competitive streak from somewhere.

Rita Black [00:34:43]:
Does she compete on a team?

Dr. Christine Li [00:34:46]:
She just restarted. So but, yeah, she's yeah. She's a vibrant, vibrant woman for sure.

Rita Black [00:34:53]:
That is amazing. So when people get clear, what are some positive things that you see people like stepping into because they've cleared their space?

Dr. Christine Li [00:35:07]:
I think just the enjoyment of the space is actually no small feat. Mhmm. Because I see people's before and after pictures, and the after pictures are like magazine layouts with the light streaming in and the furniture just fits just perfectly in the space. And you can almost feel the person's joy, even though they're not in the picture, which I think is really great. And the transformations that people can do in such a short amount of time. I work with people in a very short span of a week to 7 days around decluttering, I think is just amazing. So aside from the space transformation, there is the personal energy transformation where people do feel physically lighter. That's what I experience every time I manage to declutter.

Dr. Christine Li [00:35:59]:
And also more positively oriented. So more willing to see, more able to see what the opportunities are, instead of feeling burdened by shame, guilt, embarrassment, can't have people over stuff, which is is very prevalent because clutter is very prevalent. And so I'd love to see people connecting more, being more open, just opening your heart again. I think those are the great side effects of doing this work.

Rita Black [00:36:27]:
Yeah. Okay. If they have somebody else in their household fluttering as well, do they kind of have a talk with them and get their permission or get them in involved in the project as well? Have you seen that happen?

Dr. Christine Li [00:36:42]:
The beautiful thing that I've seen over and over again is that they come to the work feeling very frustrated by other family members, but they leave the work feeling like they're really supported by the other family members because the energy changes in the home, once one person's energy changes. And so people can't resist helping, which I think is funny, beautiful. And also just like, well, of course, they're gonna help because they want that vibe, as well. They want a clean, energized, uplifting space as well. Cool.

Rita Black [00:37:21]:
Well, you have a challenge coming up. So tell us about this challenge that if you can join for free, right? Is that correct?

Dr. Christine Li [00:37:30]:
Yes, yes, yes. I invite all your listeners and all your listeners friends to join. This will be the 6th time I'm running it. It will be running starting Monday, September 16th and running for I call it a 5 day challenge, but it's just a smidge more than 5 days because we have a celebration party at the end. And each day of the challenge, I will give a little instruction about energy, about clutter, about mindset, all these little pieces that we all need to be able to just get the bravery and get the courage up to use our time to address the clutter. It's called re energize your home. And like Rita said, it's totally free. It's really this fun, super energized, like hyper energized couple of days.

Dr. Christine Li [00:38:20]:
So I invite you all to join. I've got a link for everyone to join, which is procrastinationcoach.com/yes. So it's procrastinationcoach.com/yes. And you can direct message me on Instagram if you have any questions about what I'm doing, what Rita and I have talked about, or the challenge, my Instagram is at procrastination coach.

Rita Black [00:38:48]:
And people love this. I've had so many people. We've had Christine on before, and, I've offered her challenges before. And people are like, I love that challenge. That was so fun. It is very thrilling for so many people. So well, I'm glad you're doing this again. I'm excited, and I'm excited to have, people sign up and enjoy this and get their space clean.

Rita Black [00:39:12]:
I do think it is so important. I've been doing a lot of cleaning of I've gotta clean my I promised to clean my closet before I turn 60. So I have some room for some new, like, fantastic clothes for my sixties. I love it.

Dr. Christine Li [00:39:28]:
And what a great role model you've been to all of us, your listeners, but also to me as well as you know. And what a great way to celebrate this new transition for you. Right? Yes. New close, open closet, you know, dream big, look great, feel great.

Dr. Christine Li [00:39:45]:
Yeah. And

Dr. Christine Li [00:39:45]:
Yes. Thank you. Thank you for letting me share all this stuff

Dr. Christine Li [00:39:49]:
about the

Dr. Christine Li [00:39:49]:
clutter and the challenge on the show today.

Rita Black [00:39:51]:
Oh, yes. And tell us those links one more time just in case people didn't hear it, and I will be putting them in the show notes as well.

Dr. Christine Li [00:39:58]:
Sure. Thanks. It's procrastinationcoach.com/yes.

Rita Black [00:40:04]:
Awesome. Well, thank you, doctor Christine. It was great to have you on, and we will have you again back again. This was a great topic. Look

Dr. Christine Li [00:40:13]:
forward to it. Bye, everyone. Thanks, Rita.

Rita Black [00:40:15]:
Thank you, doctor Christine. That was amazing. I always always love our chats. And don't forget, doctor Christine has a 5 day challenge starting September 16th and running through 20th called reenergize your home. It's a 5 day challenge. It's free. Go sign up. The links are in the show notes.

Dr. Christine Li [00:40:39]:
Thank you for listening to this episode of the Make Time For Success podcast. If you enjoyed what you heard, you can subscribe to make sure you get notified of upcoming episodes. You can also visit our website, make time for success podcast.com, for past episodes, show notes, and all the resources we mentioned on the show. Feel free to connect with me over on Instagram too. You can find me there under the name, procrastination coach. Send me a DM and let me know what your thoughts are about the episodes you've been listening to, and let me know any topics that you might like me to talk about on the show. I'd love to hear all about how you're making time for success. Talk to you soon.